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Post by CThrash13 on Jan 3, 2006 23:40:00 GMT -5
I gotcha. Just be careful with the whole race thing. It can get ugly...
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Post by cowgirl4life30 on Jan 3, 2006 23:45:38 GMT -5
the only reason i said it is so it doesn't go in that direction, like these topics always do. I would much rather people name names and give examples of the riders they don't like then say "all the brazilians".
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Post by csb on Jan 4, 2006 0:48:01 GMT -5
True you don't have to like them but it's hard to deny the fact that there were 6 Brazilians in the top 20 at the end of last season. That may not sound like a lot, but to me that just says "hey we have a fire lit under our asses and we're gonna let you know it!" to me. You don't usually get to the top of the pack unless your doing something right, right? And the way I read a couple of prior posts y'all make it sound like EVERY Brazilian "soaks" his bull. How do you know that its just not an off day? You have off day's why can't the bull? I'm not condoning "soaking" your bull but if I read your posts correctly you make it sound like every time a Brazilian gets on a bull they "soak" him. Well that 91 Guilherme Marchi put on Red Jacket was awfully good for "soaking" him dont you think? Or that Hornet made short order of Adriano this past weekend...did an awfully good job of it considering he "soaked" him don't you think? I find it EXTREMELY odd that good bulls such as Hells Bells, Werewolf , Little Slinger, Rotten Cotten, and Barbwire (just to name a few) just happen to run off when a Brazilian is on their back. Kinda weird, I guess those Brazilians just strike fear in the bulls hearts, and so they run off. Take a look at Guilherme Marchis rides over the past year. He has more below 80 point rides than ANY other rider on the BFTS. Its strange, isnt it? Its not the fact that they take a long time in the chute, its the fact that they take forever AND have five hands pulling on their rope, sometimes repulling two or three times. Some bulls can take it, some bulls cant. They shouldnt have to. Contractors have gone as far as telling the rider to get off the bull, and turning the bull out. Id like to see this practice performed in the PBR. No, its not just Brazilians, and its not all of them that soak bulls and piss around inthe box. Its more than one though, and so its a problem. |
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mlm18
Challenger Tour
St. Louis 8 Second Fantasy Winner
Posts: 168
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Post by mlm18 on Jan 4, 2006 5:32:57 GMT -5
Personally I've always liked the Brazilian riders, most of my favorite riders are Brazilian.
As for the dabate on soaking.....it always rubbed me the wrong way when someone would talk about riders "soaking" bulls and the only people they would mention were Bazilians. As mentioned by people before, it's not just the Brazilians. I'm sure others pull tight ropes and others definitely take forever in the chute. Personally if they crack down on one group of riders they need to crack down on them all.
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Post by CThrash13 on Jan 4, 2006 10:03:48 GMT -5
Cody seems to have no problem naming the Brazilians who "soak" their bulls. However, everyone else says there are other non-Brazilians who "soak" their bulls as well. I would like to know what other PBR riders (non-Brazilians) "soak" their bulls. I can't name any off the top of my head, but I would like to watch to see if you are right or not.
So Kelly, name some other PBR riders that soak their bulls. That way, I can check it out this weekend.
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Post by cowgirl4life30 on Jan 4, 2006 10:52:08 GMT -5
hmmm... The majority of the 70 pt scrores I can see is on brand new bulls that we never saw again... and you can't deny that a lot of guys (other than Brazilians have had low scores on new bulls). The only two he had on veteran bulls are Fu Man Chu, whom is iffy in his outs. The other was Intimidator who used to be an awesome bull but hasn't been above mid-80's all last season (with Matt Bohon being the last b4 Marchi to ride him for 84.5pts)
Hells Bells got partically the same bull score with LJ Jenkins in Minneapolis this weeekend (the next out after Marchi had him).
I find it funny that a lot of people think he scores so much lower on these bulls. I just looked at the first page of his rides and every bull (exception of those rides listed above) the bull scores are all either right at or above the bull's average score. So that means that if the scores are lower it is lower because of Marchi's end of the score, not the bull.
Cody- I am not going to name names... I don't feel that any guy "soaks" bulls regularly. I don't see it as a problem. If you would like me to name names of guys that score lower than others because of their style (nothing to do with soaking the bull) which is what I have always said about Marchi then I will think about the list of guys and post it later.
CB- if Marchi had 5 guys pulling his rope like you said, he would be fined over and over again and forced to stop the second he is caught... So maybe you are being sarcastic but nobody is going to get away with 3+ guys pulling their ropes.
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Post by chrisshiversluver on Jan 4, 2006 12:07:27 GMT -5
Its just that the Brazilians are known to be in the chute longer than alot of other guys. Im not trying to generalize them im just saying its a known fact. One person that comes to mind is Gerardo Venegas, he seems to pull his bull rope tight, then take all day to get seated. You dont see many aussies or americans for that matter be in the chute for a minute and half or more. The one thing that they did do at the finals that i liked, was put the lights in the front of the chute that turned red when you were in the chute for too long. I think it helped emmensly, that way when it turned red they knew they had to get out of there or get a serious fine. I agree that sometime that Brazilians are picked on in this matter, but its only because they have proved over and over again, that they are in the chutes much longer than other riders. I think that the contractors should complain about this regularly, as to push it so that no one can "soak " the bull anymore. That way (almost) every body will be happy  |
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Post by rossco4worldchamp on Jan 4, 2006 12:37:44 GMT -5
I do like the red light idea. It just makes sense. It's not always the final score that counts but the fact that you stayed on your bull no matter what the score. I do think that some guys (no matter where they are from) do stay in the chute too long. It's not consistantly the same men doing it every event, but I think that a lot of the guys from time to time do it unintentionally. I really like the red light idea that would help the bulls stay healthy, let the contractors get what they deserve, give the riders the points they deserve, and make it a fair game all around.#shave#
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Post by WI8SecFan on Jan 4, 2006 12:53:36 GMT -5
You all need to be discussing bull scores not final ride scores. A bull can out perform anything that he has ever done and if the rider is hanging off the side of course the score is going to be low. Many times riders like Helton and Renato are almost bucked off then make a great move to get back to center. Another guy may have a no score but they end up with a low score instead. It does not mean the bull bucked any less.
Bulls also buck differently based on the style of the rider. A guy that uses his legs to ride more is going to get a different ride then the guy that relies more on upper body strength.
As far as the light bars go I think that if you watch the bars you may be surprised at which riders nod after the red light. I did not see the bars in Minneapolis though so they may have decided against using them in the future.
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Post by rossco4worldchamp on Jan 4, 2006 12:59:00 GMT -5
Speaking of looking at bull scores and not the riders how about Justin's infamous ride at the finals?
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Post by WI8SecFan on Jan 4, 2006 15:20:14 GMT -5
Here are some bull score stats for the Brazilian riders that have been mentioned:
Guilherme Marchi
Bulls 118
Bull Scores Higher 66
Bull Scores Lower 52
Ednei
Bulls 115
Bull Scores Higher 68
Bull Scores Lower 47
Paulo Crimber
Bulls 227
Bull Scores Higher 128
Bull Scores Lower 99
Adriano Moraes
Bulls 134
Bull Scores Higher 68
Bull Scores Lower 66
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Post by justapbrfan on Jan 4, 2006 16:54:13 GMT -5
Cowgirl4life30 - I misread the post....I was tired and I thought you were mad at me. Ok maybe J-dub doesn't "soak" his bull...maybe he's just through? I was pretty peeved when I wrote that original post about J-Dub "soaking" his bull. I apoligize to J-Dub fans out there.
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Post by chrisshiversluver on Jan 4, 2006 18:05:25 GMT -5
WI8secfan: i dont really get your post, what does that prove??
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Post by cowgirl4life30 on Jan 4, 2006 18:47:45 GMT -5
Its just that the Brazilians are known to be in the chute longer than alot of other guys. Im not trying to generalize them im just saying its a known fact. One person that comes to mind is Gerardo Venegas, he seems to pull his bull rope tight, then take all day to get seated. You dont see many aussies or americans for that matter be in the chute for a minute and half or more. The one thing that they did do at the finals that i liked, was put the lights in the front of the chute that turned red when you were in the chute for too long. I think it helped emmensly, that way when it turned red they knew they had to get out of there or get a serious fine. I agree that sometime that Brazilians are picked on in this matter, but its only because they have proved over and over again, that they are in the chutes much longer than other riders. hmmm.. Gerardo is from Mexico... that in no way makes him Brazilian. If so Rocky McDonald would be Brazilian too. The two different countries are nothing alike and don't even have the same language. Back to my last post about guys that score low. Greg Potter, Cory Rasch, Wiley Peterson, Chad Denton, Mike Lee. All these riders have a lot of low 80's scores on bulls and some 70 pt scores. Wiley didn't get a single 90 pt ride last year (that I see at least). Do all these guys cause the bulls to not perform? I don't think so. The ride score and bull scores don't mean anything, unless you want to start accusing all the guys with non-flashy riding styles of soaking their bulls. Marchi and Potter are big guys that ride with strength. Lee and Peterson make the rides look easy. There are a lot of reasons for low scores besides soaking bulls. |
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Post by justapbrfan on Jan 4, 2006 19:13:16 GMT -5
I agree with cowgirl4life30...Just cause you don't ride flashy doesn't mean that you soaked your bull to cause a lower score.
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